Did I miss something because I'm

BIG JOE

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This situation is so complex and multi-layered that I don't think there is a single reason, or single person/entity responsible. In fact, it isn't even from a single President, as it has spanned multiple administrations and political parties! But, in the end, the American people take the hit. :confused:

For the Common Hard Working Citizen Taxpayer ?

The above sez it ALL.

We were warned for Years this collapse would occur..

And it did.

Joe
 

platinum01

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This is crazy I am back in Florida now and it is hell looking for Diesel. Have is mapped out now were I can get it but nothing like back in Texas. Fuel prices are pretty nice now. Just filled up today and paid 3.59 doesn't hurt that bad anymore.
 

95_stroker

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This situation is so complex and multi-layered that I don't think there is a single reason, or single person/entity responsible. In fact, it isn't even from a single President, as it has spanned multiple administrations and political parties! But, in the end, the American people take the hit. :confused:

For the Common Hard Working Citizen Taxpayer ?

The above sez it ALL.

We were warned for Years this collapse would occur..

And it did.

Joe

I agree to a degree with you guys but theres been one entity left unmentioned (unless I missed it)....

What about the common everyday person who was TAKING THESE LOANS OUT??? Where does their responsibility lie in this mess? Why has it been OK for us to go out and load ourselves with debt because the big bad bankers gave us the money..... man, I got rope in my garage if anybody just wants to hang themselves.

There has to be some responsibility on the US citizens on a personal level. Some folks got in a bad way legitimately (unexpected loss of job, possibly taking a huge hit with a health care issue etc etc) but by and large you had folks purchasing homes that were WAY over valued with income potential that was way under par and they were doing it with 50 year mortgages, interest only mortgages, ARM's and when they got into their house the immediately went to the car dealer and put a 50K truck in the garage and then off to the toy store and put a 50K boat or RV in the driveway. Then they started buying groceries and paying living expenses on credit.......

This has been coming for about 15 years now, as Ken mentioned, no single administration can be blamed for this mess.
 

DaveBen

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I think you hit the nail on the head, Mike. The average citizen has caused almost all of this financial mess. AND they are still advertising new cars cheap, on the radio... There is enough blame to go around, for sure!

Dave
 

kenholl

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Dave/Mike, I totally agree with both of you! I am weary of the entitlement mentality that says "the gov't/others is resposible from protecting me from myself". I mostly was commenting on the "This is all Fannie/Freddie's fault" rhetoric. Oh, if it were only that simple...

Fannie/Freddie are the scapegoats in all of this, and a great excuse to blame the other political party, whichever it may be. This way, Joe Sixpack doesn't have to accept ownership of the situation he is in.
 

BIG JOE

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I agree to a degree with you guys but theres been one entity left unmentioned (unless I missed it)....

What about the common everyday person who was TAKING THESE LOANS OUT??? Where does their responsibility lie in this mess? Why has it been OK for us to go out and load ourselves with debt because the big bad bankers gave us the money..... man, I got rope in my garage if anybody just wants to hang themselves.

There has to be some responsibility on the US citizens on a personal level. Some folks got in a bad way legitimately (unexpected loss of job, possibly taking a huge hit with a health care issue etc etc) but by and large you had folks purchasing homes that were WAY over valued with income potential that was way under par and they were doing it with 50 year mortgages, interest only mortgages, ARM's and when they got into their house the immediately went to the car dealer and put a 50K truck in the garage and then off to the toy store and put a 50K boat or RV in the driveway. Then they started buying groceries and paying living expenses on credit.......

This has been coming for about 15 years now, as Ken mentioned, no single administration can be blamed for this mess.

I think you hit the nail on the head, Mike. The average citizen has caused almost all of this financial mess. AND they are still advertising new cars cheap, on the radio... There is enough blame to go around, for sure!

Dave

Dave/Mike, I totally agree with both of you! I am weary of the entitlement mentality that says "the gov't/others is resposible from protecting me from myself". I mostly was commenting on the "This is all Fannie/Freddie's fault" rhetoric. Oh, if it were only that simple...

Fannie/Freddie are the scapegoats in all of this, and a great excuse to blame the other political party, whichever it may be. This way, Joe Sixpack doesn't have to accept ownership of the situation he is in.

You guyz are Right On The Money.

I "didn't want to go there" with the Personal Responcibility side of all of this. Few of us members know each other on that level. But I TOTALLY AGREE with you guyz.

Personal Responsibility, or Culpability for any part of this Market/Financial Crash ? What ? NO ! It's the Guberments Fault. There MUST be a City, County, State or Federal Program.... for personal protection. This Country owes me that.

Thats the thinking these dayz. Sadly. (JMO)
 

sagebel

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I think "earning an honest living" and "working for everything you have" have gone by the wayside.
 

95_stroker

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I think "earning an honest living" and "working for everything you have" have gone by the wayside.
True to a degree, problem is that in the recent past (10-15 years) we were celebrating how low our national unemployment rate was..... problem being all those that were previously unemployed got employed in minimum wage jobs (ala wal-mart and the like) and with the loose lending practices all you have to have is a job to make payments on what ever it was you wanted to purchase that you couldnt afford.

If our unemployment rate was low (2-3%) and all of those folks were making real money then we wouldnt be here today either. Pretty much since unemployment statistics have been kept our national average was 6-7% then alla sudden we were at 2%. Big deal eh?

And no, I am not in favor of raising our national minimum wage either. By and large people that earn minimum wage are being paid what they are worth. Minimum wage was meant to be for part time employees such as students, retired folks filling in some time in their busy day and folks between real jobs. It was never meant to be a wage that should support a family and the lifestyle that so many think should be granted to them.
 

DaveBen

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Once upon a time in a village, a man appeared and announced to the villagers that he would buy monkeys for $10 each.

The villagers, seeing that there were many monkeys around, went out to the forest and started catching them. The man bought thousands at $10 and, as supply started to diminish, the villagers stopped their effort. He further announced that he would now buy at $20 for a monkey.

This renewed the efforts of the villagers and they started catching monkeys again. Soon the supply diminished even further and people started going back to their farms. The offer increased to $25 each, and the supply of monkeys became so small that it was an effort to even find a monkey, let alone catch it!

The man now announced that he would buy monkeys at $50! However, since he had to go to the city on some business, his assistant would now buy on behalf of him.


In the absence of the man, the assistant told the villagers. Look at all these monkeys in the big cage that the man has collected. I will sell them to you at $35, and when the man returns from the city, you can sell them to him for $50 each.

The villagers rounded up all their savings and bought all the monkeys.

They never saw the man nor his assistant again, only monkeys everywhere!

Now you have a better understanding of how Wall Street works.
 
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