newbie here-need some help please

[OutalineF350]

OK guys, well I introduced myself in the newbie section a couple weeks ago and I got some good advise on an issue I was having, but unfortunately the problem is getting worse. I just bought a 2005 F350 FX4 crew cab with 55,000 miles on it. I bought it from a dealer in Utah, had it shipped to Las Vegas where I live and first time I start it the CEL was on. Ran the code at Autozone, it said EGR malfunction. Members on here suggested I pull the EGR and clean it-which I did, reset the code, light went off for about 20 miles then came on again. So took it in to my local Ford dealer, found out that the dealer I bought it from just had the EGR replaced in February, along with the #1 injector. This time my dealer tells me the EGR needs to be replaced again, as well as the Fuel Control Modulator. Thankfully this is all covered under warranty...however....picked the truck up last night, drove to work this morning, on the way home from work...the CEL came on again -mad went straight to Ford, told them whats wrong, the ran the code again and said "well the EGR is showing malfunction again but we can't run an accurate test because you have an aftermarket airbox on there."
The truck came with a AFE Magnum intake....that's the only mod I'm aware of, no programmers or anything like that, just an intake. The dealer is trying to tell me that the mass airflow sensor is not in the correct position and the engine may be getting too much air???
The told me I need to get a hold of a stock air box so they can run an accurate test on the vehicle, they would put one on just to run the test but they have none in stock or laying around....and apparently they are $600 new to order one!!!
Sorry to be so long winded, but can a simple intake cause this much trouble???
Also does any one have a stock intake laying around I can buy off them?
Thanks

 

[KRISTOLSON]

I would go get your deductible back and take your truck to a different dealer. Some places have trained mechanics to deal with powerstrokes and some don't. This sounds like one that does not. The intake should have absolutely nothing to do with the egr malfunction. I would be pretty pissed if a dealer told me something like that.

 

[OutalineF350]

I would go get your deductible back and take your truck to a different dealer. Some places have trained mechanics to deal with powerstrokes and some don't. This sounds like one that does not. The intake should have absolutely nothing to do with the egr malfunction. I would be pretty pissed if a dealer told me something like that.

Yeah I am pretty pissed because this dealer tried to pull this crap with me a few years ago on a different vehicle. Blamed aftermarket parts, yet their parts store is full of custom accessories!
Good thing I didn't have to pay the deductible, the Utah Ford dealer took care of it because the CEL was on when I took delivery of the truck.
What do you think I should tell them tomorrow? If I take it too another dealer, I will most likely have to pay the deductible.

 

[dpantazis]

the service writer is telling you the truth "we can't run an accurate test because" . don;t rail one the service director just yet. he is telling you something between the lines.

it would make sense that the MAF can be affected by intake restrictions. remember, the element is calibrated over a certain airflow. if it is sensing something out of the PCM's range, it will throw it off.

the OEM airbox is the AIS system and runs about $250 delivered. it was engineered by donaldson and has been battle tested in the middle east sandbox. its a great filter. just google AIS. you could probably sell the AFE and recover some of your money too!

powerstrokeshop.com had a pretty good price on it. powerstrokeshop.com would be the place i would check the part numbers of the filter houseing but they are down ???

here is another example - Ford Intakes , AIS Filters

i am guessing that its going to be a drop in for the 6.0's as i have a 7.3 and that ford would not have 2 different air filters.

get the filter sleeve to but put it on AFTER you get this mess figured out.

dennis

 

[Dogman]

OutalineF350, Make sure the EGR is pluged in. I got my truck from the dealer after they put in a new EGR and it was not pluged in all the way.

 

[KRISTOLSON]

the service writer is telling you the truth "we can't run an accurate test because" . don;t rail one the service director just yet. he is telling you something between the lines.

it would make sense that the MAF can be affected by intake restrictions. remember, the element is calibrated over a certain airflow. if it is sensing something out of the PCM's range, it will throw it off.

He is not getting an MAF fault.....? It is an egr code, right? This happens all the time, a dealer tries to fix it once, then when they cant get it, tell you it is aftermarket parts. sounds to me like there is something deeper that is being overlooked. Did they pull out the egr cooler and check that for restriction as well? I would do what dogman says, check the plug but I wouldn't spend too much time working on it. The dealer is obligated to fix the problem under warranty. If there is an issue with the deductible, get ford involved, make sure they know that this dealer is jerking you around, and tell them you want to take it to another dealer. If they won't cough up the c-note, just rest assured that 100 dollars is a great investment in a qualified shop to work on your shiny new truck.

 

[OutalineF350]

I'm trying to call them back...but my service writter isn't in yet. Yesterday he told me they will fix whatever needs to be fixed and they will take care of the deductible since it was just there less then 24 hours ago, but in order for them to figure out what is wrong and run some accurate tests, they need me to find a stock air box. I just don't see why this would cause the problem, the AFE Magnum intake supposedly keeps all emmision sensors in the OE locations....yet the technician is saying the MAF is too far away from something to read the airflow properly

There are so many trucks with intakes out there, I think if they caused issues like this, no one would use them. I've never had a problem before with an intake on any of my vehicles.

 

[dpantazis]

how do you think that the EGR valve knows when to open and close? the angle bone is connected to the thigh bone... in this case, it PCM gets one of its signals from the MAF, then decides to tell the EGR to open or close and by how much.

it does not matter what, or how good the aftermarket intake is. fords tools are designed around STOCK equipment. if the intake flows more or less air than stock, the test may not be accurate. no more, no less. that is all they are telling you.

if the signal from the MAF is out of range for the PCM and that what the scan tools picking up, he is not lying to you. your MAF could be bad too. they get crudded up when junk gets past the filter. they are not cheap but they are not expensive either.

there are lots of K&N filters out there too. does that make them better? all that goes to show you is that the marketing and add campaigns sell lots of product.

if you are having these problems now, consider the oem AIS to be your insurance you are not going to get a hassled again later. as you can see, EGR problems are recurring on some trucks.

 

[OutalineF350]

how do you think that the EGR valve knows when to open and close? the angle bone is connected to the thigh bone... in this case, it PCM gets one of its signals from the MAF, then decides to tell the EGR to open or close and by how much.

it does not matter what, or how good the aftermarket intake is. fords tools are designed around STOCK equipment. if the intake flows more or less air than stock, the test may not be accurate. no more, no less. that is all they are telling you.

if the signal from the MAF is out of range for the PCM and that what the scan tools picking up, he is not lying to you. your MAF could be bad too. they get crudded up when junk gets past the filter. they are not cheap but they are not expensive either.

there are lots of K&N filters out there too. does that make them better? all that goes to show you is that the marketing and add campaigns sell lots of product.

if you are having these problems now, consider the oem AIS to be your insurance you are not going to get a hassled again later. as you can see, EGR problems are recurring on some trucks.

Yeah I see what your saying. I'm just pissed because my new truck has spent more days in the shop then I have gotten to drive it
and now I have to track down a stock air box.
The AIS you are refering to, where is it? I went to that site and the only one I seen was for the 7.3L. I have a 6.0 PS. Also they said it needs to be the updated air box because mine takes the newer version?? Will this one work eBay Motors: Air intake and filter assembly for 2003-2006 Ford F250 (item 200325105723 end time Apr-03-09 10:42:25 PDT)

 

[KRISTOLSON]

Well, either way, I will BET YOU MONEY, even when you put the stock intake back on, you are going to still have the CEL and the EGR fault code. Then what is this ford dealer going to say? You may very well get another get rid of you excuse, and you are out a couple hundred you could have put towards a deductible at a qualified shop. Just my opinion, I don't want to piss anyone off but OutalineF350 never said the maf sensor was out of range. The only code he stated was pulled was the egr fault. Also if the problem was in the MAF and intake wouldn't the computer pop out a MAF out of range code? I believe there are a TON of signals the computer uses when telling the egr to open, however my understanding was it was based more on rpm and throttle position. The thing with the egr fault is that it indicates that the egr itself is still not functioning correctly. Maybe the dealer only cleaned it and did not in fact replace it. Maybe it was a bad valve they put in. Like I said before, there are a lot more items on the egr circuit where there could be a restriction/problem. Just me, I am not a big fan of dealership service departments. It is like no one can think through a problem without a computer anymore.

Whatever you do, dont give up on this. Failed egr systems/coolers have caused many a hydrolock/head gasket blowout on the 6.0

and if you do buy that intake, the one you looked at on ebay will work. The new stock intake with the oval filter is way better than most aftermarket ones anyway. You will likely get better performance out of the stock system.

also a note about dealer shops that I found out the hard way... Ford dealerships are all independently owned so therefore Ford has no say as to how much or how little specialized training that their techs get. Ford can't even get involved in a customer dispute, all you can do is file a complaint with them. And after like 100 complaints their dealership MAY come up for review. It is especially hard to find a GOOD ford shop with a GOOD diesel mechanic. Dealer shops will vary greatly from one to the next, and you said you have been jerked around by these guys before, right? Maybe time to cut losses. But this is all just my opinion so no one get offended.
END OF RANT