flat tax or fair tax???

JimmyDee

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"Continuing to work while receiving "benefits" did not used to reduce your "benefit".

Has as far back as I can remember. They keep raising the amount you can earn every year. I think it is up to 12k or 13K now. I remember way back in the 70s it was somewhere in the 8k or 9k area. It won't be long and the benefit will only be covering my medical costs. If you want to be angry about something, the medical costs would be something to take on. Sure seems like the lawyers and malpractice have a lot to do with this cost.
25 years ago I would have agreed with you on SS but now that I receiving SS, it sure is great. :thumbs
Jim
 
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Hoss 350

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While a flat tax is a good idea, IMHO, simply because it reduces so much work and worry, and virtually eliminates the IRS, you have to be careful about who is proposing the issue and what their agenda is.

Steve Forbes is a good example of a guy who promotes the flat tax, but does so for his own good, not because of some altruistic sense of doing good for the little guy. His proposal, and those of many others, do not allow for taxation of investment returns and dividends.

Since Steve Forbes has never really done anything in his entire life, other than ride his daddies coat tails, this would make him pretty much tax free, along with the majority of other wealthy people in the country (Paul Allens, Bill Gates, etc). On top of that, his plans typically give reflief to the poor (typically incomes around 25K and less). So guess what? Mr. Forbes, once again, has decided that the cost to run this country should come out of the pockets of the middle class, since the rich and the poor are exempted.

A flat tax is only a good idea if it applies across the board to everybody and every source of income. When you start playing favorites, you get in trouble, big time.

My recommendation is a flat 17-20% tax on everything that is, under today's tax laws, considered income, including dividends, and interest income from investments, ROI, etc... The tax rate would reduce itself to 15% for households with incomes under 30K, 10% on households from 27,500 to 25,001, and 0% to households under 25K.

THis allows us to give the poor an advantage tax-wise, to help them pull themselves up by their boot straps. It does not play favorites with the insanely wealthy, and does not overburden the middle class. Once you get rid of deductions and all of that crap, you end up having about the same rate of tax income to the government as before with higher rates and deductions. Oh, and you get to reduce the operating budget of the IRS by MILLIONS to save more money...
 

Tx_Atty

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Hoss 350 said:
My recommendation is a flat 17-20% tax on everything that is, under today's tax laws, considered income, including dividends, and interest income from investments, ROI, etc... The tax rate would reduce itself to 15% for households with incomes under 30K, 10% on households from 27,500 to 25,001, and 0% to households under 25K.

not trying to pick an argument, this is what is known as a "graduated income tax" and is only slightly less complex that what we have. A true flat tax is just that, flat, not graduated. It should be even for everyone. We all have the same basic opportunities in this country even if some have more initial advantage.

The poor could improve their situation if so many weren't too cool to finish high school or too busy getting their fat girlfriends pregnant. I was with my wife at a sonogram yesterday when a couple walked in, unmarried, carrying an 18 month old girl and the 18 or 19 year old girl was, once again, heavily pregnant. Im sorry but I do not feel any compulsion to pay more tax while this pair of idiots continues to get pregnant before they can even vote. He probably had to get her pregnant the first time on the handle bars of his schwinn.

There will always be poor and many simply cannot do anything about it but there are plenty who can but wont.
 

powerboatr

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Tx_Atty said:
not trying to pick an argument, this is what is known as a "graduated income tax" and is only slightly less complex that what we have. A true flat tax is just that, flat, not graduated. It should be even for everyone. We all have the same basic opportunities in this country even if some have more initial advantage.

The poor could improve their situation if so many weren't too cool to finish high school or too busy getting their fat girlfriends pregnant. I was with my wife at a sonogram yesterday when a couple walked in, unmarried, carrying an 18 month old girl and the 18 or 19 year old girl was, once again, heavily pregnant. Im sorry but I do not feel any compulsion to pay more tax while this pair of idiots continues to get pregnant before they can even vote. He probably had to get her pregnant the first time on the handle bars of his schwinn.

There will always be poor and many simply cannot do anything about it but there are plenty who can but wont.

;tu

dividend re-investments under 10k should be tax free, I get screwed every year and I aint no millionaire







YET :D
 

Hoss 350

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Tx_Atty said:
not trying to pick an argument, this is what is known as a "graduated income tax" and is only slightly less complex that what we have. A true flat tax is just that, flat, not graduated. It should be even for everyone. We all have the same basic opportunities in this country even if some have more initial advantage.

The poor could improve their situation if so many weren't too cool to finish high school or too busy getting their fat girlfriends pregnant. I was with my wife at a sonogram yesterday when a couple walked in, unmarried, carrying an 18 month old girl and the 18 or 19 year old girl was, once again, heavily pregnant. Im sorry but I do not feel any compulsion to pay more tax while this pair of idiots continues to get pregnant before they can even vote. He probably had to get her pregnant the first time on the handle bars of his schwinn.

There will always be poor and many simply cannot do anything about it but there are plenty who can but wont.

I agree with you with all of my being, but i am realistic enough to realize that a tax that does not "graduate" itself to help the poor will never get passed by the bleeding hearts in Washington. If you look at my idea, it really is MUCH more simple than what we have now. It goes pretty easy...

The first 25 K of your income is taxed at 0%. From 25 to 27500 you get taxed 10%. From 27500 to 30, you get taxed 15%. Anything above 30 that is income is taxed at 19%. It is that simple. A 6th grader could figure it out. No big fuss, no big IRS, and no tax day stress.

I totally agree with your issues, the lady at the sandwich shop I go to get lunch just left for "maternity leave" (she got fired because she kept not showing up) to have her 3rd child from a 3rd father that she cannot support or pay for, so she is on DSHS and Welfare and food stamps and so on and so forth. She has this attitude like it is her God-given right to have babies, and who are you to tell her different. Try to explain to her the idea of her responsiblity to take care of that child once it is born, and she just looks at you with a dumb look on her face. Ask her why she thinks it is my responsibility to take care of her child, and she would say "well, do you want it to starve?" She has no recognition that with life comes responsibility. She can do whatever she wants, and just let everybody else take care of her...

I hate subsidizing that. I just hate it. But the problem is that these people will do it whether you pay for it or not, and if we don't, we'll end up having gangs of starving children roaming the streets. Ther is no easy solution to stupidity, man....
 

Tx_Atty

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I could live with what you outline (at least in theory). It beats the AMT and the current tax cap - what is it, 39%? I wonder how/where we could get the necessary figures to do a mathematical comparison of what the current system and a proposal such as yours would net out. I guess it would be practically impossible once you try to figure in what the gov would really save by disbanding so much of the IRS and whoever else we could send home.

sounds like a good phd dissertation.
 

Hoss 350

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Location: 7th level of hell...

Judecca, eh?
So, are you sharing the mouth with Judas Iscariot, Brutus, or Cassius? Or are you a lesser 7th region denizen who is simply frozen in "straws of ice" for all eternity?

I guess you all didn't know, but Dante says hell froze over hundreds of years ago.... :D
 

Hoss 350

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Tx_Atty said:
sounds like a good phd dissertation.
Which, unfortunately, is literally what it would become... :rolleyes:

Also, disbanding the IRS would be a pain due to all of the entrenched, entitlement-minded governement workers suddenly forced to work for a living and released on the open market. We would have legions of lazy, entitled government lackeys clogging the employment lines, each of them waiting for a job where they only have to accomplish 1 hour of work in an 8 hour work day (including a 2 hour lunch) and get paid WAY more than they are worth and get gold plated benefits and retirement. :rolleyes: :eek:
 

Tx_Atty

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Actually I probably fit into Purgatory with a visible source for exit. Distantly visible though.
 

powerboatr

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Hoss 350 said:
Which, unfortunately, is literally what it would become... :rolleyes:

Also, disbanding the IRS would be a pain due to all of the entrenched, entitlement-minded governement workers suddenly forced to work for a living and released on the open market. We would have legions of lazy, entitled government lackeys clogging the employment lines, each of them waiting for a job where they only have to accomplish 1 hour of work in an 8 hour work day (including a 2 hour lunch) and get paid WAY more than they are worth and get gold plated benefits and retirement. :rolleyes: :eek:


ouch, good thing they have all of us a gov. contractors to pick up the slack :eek:
8hrs of work in a 9 hr period with a .5 for lunch ;) , break is over, back on your heads

but my fed gov. service was not rewarded with gold plated retirement benies.
 
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