Duke Ugliness

[Hoss 350]

So what happens if these guys in the Duke Lacrosse case are innocent? They have already been:

1) Put on the evening news, with pictures, life and criminal histories, and their names, among other things. The word “alleged” gets lost among the hype;
2) The one that was already facing assault charges for getting in a fight with a team-mate on his high school team (which while not exactly commendable, is not exactly a big deal, either. A fight between two healthy athletes is not uncommon, nor particularly egregious) had those charges deferred since it was his first offense (he basically got community service). Now because of these allegations, the deferment has been revoked, and he is going to stand trial and probably do jail time, no matter what the outcome of the rape case is (whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Since when does an allegation get you more jail time?);
3) The guy in #2 is the same guy that has pretty solid alibi that he wasn’t even at the party at the time of the alleged rape;
4) The girl cannot identify who did it. In fact, no one is really even sure how exactly they got around to indicting these two guys in particular. No one on the team is talking, and the girl cannot identify her alleged attackers, so I am curious how they made the determination to arrest these two in particular;

These guys, from this day forward, will always be rapists, guilty or not. Just like Kobe Bryant, who I totally believe was the victim of a psycho woman who wanted attention and maybe a shot at some cash. Kobe still receives the suspicion of a lot of people, and he will always be a rapist in the eyes of some.

At least one of these boys will definitely be doing some jail time, regardless of whether he is guilty or not, specifically because of the allegations, which I don’t think a crime you committed in High School, as a first offense, being nothing more than a scuffle with a teammate, should result in incarceration (community service and a fine, yes…). Hell, I got in a few fights in my time!

Don’t get me wrong, here, because if they did it, then they need to burn. But if they didn’t do it, how do they ever get right again?

Even worse, if the girl is lying (God forbid), she got exactly what she wanted, attention and revenge against these guys for some perceived slight, and she gets to hide behind a blanket of anonymity and safety from prying eyes of the public. All she has to do is tell some bogus BS like “she can’t stand to endure the trial” (just like Kobe’s accuser did) and they call it off before it starts. She got what she wants, the DA will be too chickensh*t to subpoena her, and make her accountable for her allegations, and these guys are ruined as a result.

There just seems to be something wrong here. Innocent until proven guilty seems to have been compromised. The right to confront your accuser seems to have been compromised. There is something flawed in the way these rape cases are tried. I saw it in the Kobe case, and I see it now in this case.

My idea? If the accuser has to stay anonymous, which I think I can understand, since being raped would be a pretty private and hurtful thing, then the accused need to stay anonymous, too. Fair is fair. Our judicial system is based on everyone having an even playing ground, and if any slant or imbalance occurs, it needs to be in the favor of the accused. This has definitely slanted the favor to the accuser, and that is just not the way it should work.

Since this is a forum, I guess I am asking what YOU think?

And just to be clear, I am not flat out accusing the accuser of lying. She could be telling the truth, but even if she is, these two guys could still be innocent, since she is not sure who did it, and cannot identify her assailants

 

[ktpauley]

She can't identify her accusers. What kind of BS is this. If she can't indentify them, how does she know she was raped. What did they have masks on? For all she knows maybe Ronald McDonald did it.

 

[RenoF250]

I don't understand the mdeia hype on this case, unfortunately women are raped all of the time, why are they spending so much time on this? Because they like the idea of rich kids in trouble. Well, if they like their stories so much they should pay for it. They should not be allowed to report accused peoples names and histories without permission. If they can what stops them from deciding you are interesting and coming to your house a reavealing everything you have done. I hate the media, worthless $#%^@.

 

[JimmyDee]

I don't understand the mdeia hype on this case,

Its a black white issue more than rape.
Jim

 

[BIG JOE]

It a black white issue more than rape.
Jim

The WHOLE DAMN THING.. Is simply a Media Blitz. MORE Media crappola.

>IF< it had happened at Schmuckatelly Community College in Smallville, after the the Mens Spelling Bee.... between a'couple guys and the local, Bar Fly/Town Poke..... We would have never heard about it.

>BUT<, because it happened at >"DUKE University"<.. and it's "LaCrosse" team, between a'couple White, upper class types, and a Minority "Exotic Dancer" (Stripper).... That can't remember what happened, or, who did, just what.... it gets International Media Attention.

Sells Air Time and News Print

MONEY DRIVEN, Media Crappola.

Sad part is.. Some poor guy(s) is guna BURN. Someone HAS to Burn. To much attention has been paid to this...... YELLOW JOURNALISM.

 

[ford4life]

The DA is up for re-election and Durham County has a large percentage of minorities. DA fries some rich white kids, makes it look like he's actually doing something, maybe doesn't lose his job. If this was not an election year this would have died a long time ago. As for the stripper ID'ing the alleged rapists, she was shown pictures of the entire team with no outside people. NC law says a photo line-up must have 7 people that have nothing to do with the case for each 1 suspect. FWIW.

 

[Hoss 350]

As for the stripper ID'ing the alleged rapists, she was shown pictures of the entire team with no outside people. NC law says a photo line-up must have 7 people that have nothing to do with the case for each 1 suspect. FWIW.

Okay, at the risk of resurrecting an otherwise dead topic on this board, I looked into the above claim, ad found that it was true. The DA broke the law when he presented a lineup of ONLY lacrosse players to the accuser. It has to at lease include 7 unaffiliated individuals, and also, an unaffiliated detective must present the lineup to the accuser to avoid “tainting the well” so to speak. In this case, the lead detective presented the lineup. You may think this is not a big deal, but when the accuser claimed that one of her attackers had a moustache (none of the players had one) and obviously cannot identify any of them with certainty (according to a conversation with her father) it is a serious problem to give the accuser a multiple choice test where EVERY SINGLE ANSWER CHOICE IS CORRECT!!! This is totally bogus.

What is more, I heard some more VERY disturbing news today, which just has me beside myself, completely unsure what it is that this DA is trying to accomplish, other than get himself fired.

The DA’s office leaked information that a DNA match had been made between one of the fingernails found in the bathroom, and one of the players. This set the media aflutter with speculation, and reporting that a match had been made, and in the minds of millions of Americans, the status of these players went from “undetermined” to “GUILTY” in a flash.

NOW, we hear the truth of the matter, not from a DA press conference, but from an attorney hired by an as-of-yet un-accused player, that the leak is not true at all. Why did we have to hear clarification, and truth, from someone other than the DA if he is not trying these boys in the media for political gain? It seems open and shut to me!

The following clarifications on the leak of info were put into public knowledge by the defense attorney:
1.) The DNA “match” was no match at all, but rather a suggestion, giving an “indication” of one (or several, it was unclear) of the boys in the house. It is white-boy DNA, and matched closely enough that it sounds like they can narrow it down to the family of the person that was matched. This is not enough, generally, to convict one in a court of law, as far as I can find.
2.) HOWEVER, it was totally left out that the source of the fingernail was from a GARBAGE CAN in the bathroom, full of cotton swabs, band-aids, toilet tissues, nail trimmings, etc from the boys, ALL OF WHICH could have been the source of the contamination on the nail. It also bears mentioning that the accuser says she scratched at her attackers, yet none of the boys have any injuries whatsoever. It also bears mentioning that the fingernail was voluntarily handed over to police by the boys, which means that in handling it, they could have easily contaminated it with DNA (your fingerprints have DNA in them, for goodness sake!) It also bears mentioning that even the presence of DNA on the fingernail found BY POLICE in an UNCONTAMINATED area still proves nothing, as she could have got him while dancing earlier, or when she shook his hand, or, or, or, or….
3.) A true DNA match WAS made. It was made from the DNA material found inside her after the rape kit was done the night of the incident. The match was to her boyfriend, who also happens to be a criminal known to the Durham Police. This would account for the signs of “recent sexual activity” noted in the rape kit files.

To me, this evidence almost 100% exonerates these boys, coupled with some additional character information we have found on the accuser. She has made previous (most likely false, but not totally classified as such in the report) rape allegations. She has made previous FALSE kidnapping accusations. She has a rap sheet including assaulting a police officer, for god’s sake. Yet, unless there is some COMPELLING evidence that we have yet to see, the DA is believing her 100%, without a doubt, and is ACTIVELY undertaking a campaign to smear and damage these players as much as possible, by doing things like leaking a DNA match when none exists, at worst, and when the indication of one is tenuous, at best.

What in the heck is going on? Why can DNA evidence free men falsely convicted of rape 30 years ago, but it cannot get this DA off the backs of these guys, who I am becoming more and more convinced are innocent of everything other than being jackasses?

On a final note, one disturbing trend that I have seen is write-ins from people that keep saying that these boys are total jerks, that two of them have previous indictments against them for assault, that they are rich, arrogant, etc. They seem to miss out on the fact that none of this matters at all if they are innocent of the rape charges. Being rich, arrogant, aggressive teenagers does not make you guilty of rape. Can’t these guys see that? The flip side is that being a poor, black stripper does not necessarily mean that any accusations you make instantly become false. However, when the preponderance of the evidence points exactly to that conclusion, your accusations, and you, definitely become suspect.

 

[powerboatr]

maybe the DA suffers from the kennedy syndrome???
(purposely foul up as much evidence as possible, so no one could ever get an impartial jury, because daddy has lots of money ?????)
so what happens now is if there was a rape, which i doubt, no one will ever be convicted because of the poop perfromance of the DA.